Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Post your questions or tips about wheels, tires, alignment, or anything related to preparing an autocross car here.

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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Wed Nov 09, 2016 3:50 pm

So we've kinda started this discussion on the Nov 6th post event thread but I thought it would be a good idea to move into a dedicated thread going forward...

I myself am fairly new to Autocross, I've only run with FAST so far and I couldn't be happier. You guys are awesome and I can tell you have a passion and understanding of the sport.

I'm currently driving a 2015 Ford Focus ST Boosted w/ stock Goodyear Eagle F1 asymmetric 2's on 18's. The tires are pretty much on their last leg especially for Autocross purposes!

I really don't daily driver my car, I have a separate work vehicle so my car sits at home mostly. 6500miles since July 2015...

I plan on auto crossing at least one a month or every other month if the wife is on my case.

If you were in my shoes would you try the Federals or Nexen's?

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RS-R 235/40/18 - $127/ea free shipping (eBay)

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RS-RR 245/40/18 - $127.50/ea free shipping (eBay)

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Nexen SUR4 - 235/40/18 - $139/ea PLUS $60 shipping (TireRack)






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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Loren » Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:07 pm

People who I know and respect have run Federal RS-R and really liked them. Pretty close to on par with a Star Spec or Hankook RS3, much cheaper. If they are available in the size you need, and you can FIND them (that's the hard part), they would suit you well.

Don't know about the RS-RR (and don't want to research it right now). The Nexen is new, but has also had decent reviews. I read a Tire Rack test on them just the other day, so they've been TESTED, and there is DATA available.
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Wed Nov 09, 2016 5:59 pm

RS-R is 140AA A UTQG
RS-RR and SUR4 are 200UTQG AA A

Another forums says the RS-R isn't overly loud for daily driving where as the RS-RR sounds like an off road tire while cruising... SUR4 somewhere in the middle noise wise.

I can find all 3 available in my sizes... ahhh!! Too many choices. This past weekend the Mazda speed3 in M2 had the RS-R's he ran a 33.508 vs. my 34.367 for fastest lap. Overall between all of our runs we were about 1sec apart... he posted similar runs times to me back on 10/8 at the dog track... our cars are spec'd about the same, I guess it just comes down to driver and tires eh?




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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Native » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:50 pm

No matter what, they'll be better than what you've got. So pick the least expensive one and try it. If you aren't happy with it, move up to the next rung.
Someone in another thread somewhere said, correctly, that good tires hide bad driving. So, even if you aren't happy with the cheapo's, you'll be forced to learn to drive better for it: cheap and good - win. Cheap and learn to drive better - win. :)
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Loren » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:56 pm

Treadwear ratings are made up bullshit. Don't put any stock in them.

Very quick research indicates the RS-RR is an evolution of the RS-R. Has stiffer sidewalls. The change from 140 to 200 TW is almost definitely to make it legal for SCCA "Street" category. Probably no change in compound at all, but maybe. They do keep getting better so that you can have your cake and eat it, too. (excellent grip AND reasonable treadwear) Based on that info, I'd probably go with the RR.

I ran a 33.4 on Hankook RS3's... in the Festiva. You can't use someone else's times in a different car as a reference for tires. Tire comparisons are really only valid when it's the same driver in the same car and only the tires have changed. But, yes, autocross on the whole is all about tires and driver. Mostly driver.

I know a couple people here are currently running Nexens. Maybe they'll chime in.

Another thing to consider here is what kind of car are you driving, and what is your driving style? Heavy FWD car with lots of power, and a driver that tends to overdrive... you'll want to consider how well your tire handles heat. You'll be putting a fair amount of it into the front tires. If you're a more gentle driver, that might be less of an issue, but still worth looking into.
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The "Push Harder, Suck Less" philosophy explained:
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Wed Nov 09, 2016 8:38 pm

That's an excellent point and something I'll definitely need to look at before I pull the trigger. The reason my goodyears are already gone at 6500mi. probably has a lot to do with me overdriving the car. In the beginning it was just so fun to mash the gas, spin the wheels, pull and muscle through the tracks


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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Solar » Thu Nov 10, 2016 4:12 pm

I went through a few sets of Fed RSRs and for the money they were as good as the RS3's, they had a stiffer sidewall than the RS3s too. I would still be using them, but finding them in the size I need is impossible now. I switched to the Nexen SUR4 and I like them as much as the RSRs,and RS3s. I seriously doubt most drivers could really tell a difference in performance autocrossing them, maybe on a track they may not be as good as Rivals, RS3s, etc, but in 50 second bursts any of the tires you're looking at will do just fine. I wouldn't recommend any of the tires you listed for DD, and if you're autocrossing and driving lightly to and from events and you get 6500 miles out of any of them, you're doing great ! :)
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 5:30 pm

Solar wrote:I went through a few sets of Fed RSRs and for the money they were as good as the RS3's, they had a stiffer sidewall than the RS3s too. I would still be using them, but finding them in the size I need is impossible now. I switched to the Nexen SUR4 and I like them as much as the RSRs,and RS3s. I seriously doubt most drivers could really tell a difference in performance autocrossing them, maybe on a track they may not be as good as Rivals, RS3s, etc, but in 50 second bursts any of the tires you're looking at will do just fine. I wouldn't recommend any of the tires you listed for DD, and if you're autocrossing and driving lightly to and from events and you get 6500 miles out of any of them, you're doing great ! :)
Sweet deal, thank you for the input. Road noise wise for semi DD, which is the quieter tire?


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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby AScoda » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:29 pm

just turn up the radio
Loren wrote:Freakin' Drew and his freakin' Mustang. :no:
dan wrote:Freakin' Drew and his freakin' Miata.
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:27 pm

So... I pulled the trigger on the RS-RR's. I might as well be the guinea pig for the group as it looks like no ones had the chance to try them out.

I ordered (4) 245/40/18 $509.00 OTD FREE FedEx shipping via eBay.

Hopefully they will come in before I leave town for thanksgiving!!! I'll see you guys out at Brooksville Dec 3rd.

Also I'm going to try to use Carl if can somehow work it into my schedule. Otherwise I'm going to have to drop off my car off while I'm at work at a regular tire shop. ;(


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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby RedBRZ80 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:05 pm

Kdub085 wrote:So... I pulled the trigger on the RS-RR's. I might as well be the guinea pig for the group as it looks like no ones had the chance to try them out.

I ordered <a href="tel:(4) 245/40">(4) 245/40</a>/18 $509.00 OTD FREE FedEx shipping via eBay.

Hopefully they will come in before I leave town for thanksgiving!!! I'll see you guys out at Brooksville Dec 3rd.

Also I'm going to try to use Carl if can somehow work it into my schedule. Otherwise I'm going to have to drop off my car off while I'm at work at a regular tire shop. ;(


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So I hope your running the AM session.. I'm curious about seeing them.. (Maybe I could steal a ride, I've got the RS.. I would be happy to provide some instruction )
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Fri Nov 11, 2016 6:33 am

YES, and DEAL.

FYI someone has a set of 235/35/19's for $570.00

https://www.ebay.com/itm/112196504277

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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby RedBRZ80 » Sat Nov 12, 2016 7:33 am

Kdub085 wrote:YES, and DEAL.

FYI someone has a set of 235/35/19's for $570.00

https://www.ebay.com/itm/112196504277

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I went with a second set of wheels, so I've got 255/35 RE71s on a set of 18x8 wheels. (Wheels keep me scca legal)
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Sat Nov 12, 2016 1:39 pm

Well well well... that was FAST! Ordered on Thursday night and here Saturday afternoon.

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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Carracer » Sat Nov 12, 2016 5:36 pm

Nice!
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Native » Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:53 pm

So meaty!
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Sun Nov 13, 2016 4:55 pm

I was able to get these boys mounted today. I have got to say that they sure look a lot wider than my Goodyear's!

Let's just get this part out of the way.... THESE THINGS ARE LOUD. I MEAN 36" SUPER-SWAMPER LOUD. It sounds like I have a pack of angry bees chasing me.. lol. But it's not so bad that it would be a deal breaker. With the radio up and exhaust noise you can't really hear it, definitely some NVH tho.

I'll Write up a whole review in the coming weeks. So far though, the steering feels much firmer and almost heavy as if it was weighted... When I turn, the car goes!


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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby Kdub085 » Sun Nov 13, 2016 6:07 pm

He's a review from a fellow Autocross'er on the Focusst.org forum, just posted today.

15 TB Focus ST3 auto-x/daily build (well sort of)

Update:

The Federal 595 RS-RR's performed just as I suspected, very similar to the Hankook RS-3's. The nice thing about them is the sidewalls are very stiff and more responsive than the RS-3's. They also feel quicker than my old RE-11's and my times reflected as I was about 3 seconds faster than my direct competition in the local points standing for STX (usually 1/2 second slower than me on RE71-R's). They also seem to handle heat just as well as the RS-3's, and may have a decent wear life as well.



Downside: They are noisy as ****. Louder than the 32 inch off road tires on my wife's Tacoma. Tread depth is also something that might concern others as they only start out with a little over 7/32's of tread (good news is like I said, they seem to wear pretty well for an EP tire)



All in all, these tires performed really well, and while I still don't think they'll be super competitive at a national level, they are an excellent value for an EP tire. Don't be afraid to buy them if you are looking for a good EP tire that doesn't break the bank.



Along with the new rubber, the moog rear endlinks also helped in keeping the car more civil as snap oversteer from the endlink bind was no longer a factor.



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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby aw614 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 9:37 am

I wonder if they are as loud as the kumhos, those were bad wheeling bearing noise loud lol
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Affordable Choices... Federal RS-R, RS-RR or NEXEN SUR4

Postby ImpostorDan » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:56 am

aw614 wrote:I wonder if they are as loud as the kumhos, those were bad wheeling bearing noise loud lol

It sounds like the same category.... Kumho's were significantly louder than RS3s.

Keith, on a relative basis, are the RSRRs massively louder than RS3s?

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